Curse

Garet1337 · Aug 24, 2010, 03:50 AM // 03:50

I am not really new to monking and protting in HA but i'd like people's opinions.

What hotkeys and screen layouts should be used.
Basic stratagies for prots, and maybe even infusers.
And any other info you think is neccisary

Why not just name this how to monk succesfully in HA

X Ghoul · Aug 24, 2010, 04:51 AM // 04:51

I actually don't have time to write something of depth but.. field watch field watch field watch. Some very "common sense" things are forgotten by most people like not protting your infuse when hes getting beat down by a hammer war for 1min+ (by then its 2 late to return). Some things that help is watching the enemy mes for when he is going to use diversion and to position yourself accordingly such as the monks crying they are getting diversion/shame when they are standing right next to the enemy mes. I could come up with other things but helpful more things will be posted after/before me.

Garet1337 · Aug 24, 2010, 06:52 AM // 06:52

and some really common sence stuff like keep Aura of Stability up on healer when vsing groups with KD, channel tank if possible, watch for who caller is about to attack if vsing r spike, dont forget u have guardian, veil and pre veil if neccisary, make sure mele stays blind free and keep off conditons like deep wound if possible. Smarter players will cover enchant if neccisary (kinda like cover hexing but cover enchanting so a not so important enchant is stripped instead of lets say spirit bond or ageis) be smart with spirit bond cause some skills and spell wont set it off (like some aoe) make sure you have the right weapon set on for what you need, vs pressure have shield set and switch shield vs the type of group your playing (piercing for ranger spike, fire for sf spikes so on and so forth) if ur the infuse and running low in energy, when safe you can switch your your high energy set and use auspitious incantaion and heal party to gain energy back, just make sure to switch back to 40 40 or shield set after. Yeah that's why i kinda havn't monked for a long time cause you have to pay attention to 10000 different things at once, where as half the team can focus on a couple things at a time depending on what group and map your playing.

Tushi · Aug 24, 2010, 07:55 AM // 07:55

1. Follow damage with guardian.
2. Time aura of stability on kds like earth shaker or hammer bash so they waste skill.
3. Prot obvious spikes with aegis.
4. Make sure you stay on shield set and swap on 40/20/20 staff for prots.
5. Use aegis on whoever has to use song on koth maps.
6. On relic run your job is to keep runner clear if power running. Take care of front and let hb take care of base and ghost.
7. On forgotten shrines make sure you keep capping with ghost. If for some reason you cant move to the other side go cap mid point.
8. On Antechamber try not to get ghost stuck and keep caping. Ghost is worth 4 pips.
9. Use disciple isnignias and armor mod on spear.
10. Don't listen to Borat he is your regular HA shitter with no game knowledge.
11. Die on shield set.

Do this and you'll be great prot. But it takes lots of practice.

Sierraa · Aug 24, 2010, 09:12 AM // 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by X Ghoul

I actually don't have time to write something of depth but.. field watch field watch field watch. Some very "common sense" things are forgotten by most people like not protting your infuse when hes getting beat down by a hammer war for 1min+ (by then its 2 late to return).

You're right about watching the field though I'm not sure why you added protting your infuse since that would of course go along with watching the field. You could be a little bit more specific and say "Follow damage" as a basic how-to-prot type suggestion. Once you learn to follow damage start to watch other things such as the mesmer and the ranger and pre-veil/guardian accordingly.

Quote:

Some things that help is watching the enemy mes for when he is going to use diversion and to position yourself accordingly such as the monks crying they are getting diversion/shame when they are standing right next to the enemy mes. I could come up with other things but helpful more things will be posted after/before me.

I wasn't aware mesmers had to be in melee range to cast? I also wasn't aware that monks could reliably interrupt or shut down mesmers who camp them. I dunno, maybe HA has changed. It doesn't really matter if you're standing right next to the mesmer or if you're barely out of cast range. It's not like you can reliably run away and prot while staying in range of your team.

@OP: I mashed everything to the lower left side of my screen and disabled everything that I didn't need to see, such as hints & dialogue. I used: 1-5 zad for skills, tab and r for closest target and next target, shift as my cancel key and xcvb as my weapon swaps. Do your research about map objectives and the people in your team. Knowing their roles and knowing what your skills do to help them will mean winning or losing a lot of the time. Pay attention to whats going on around you and make sure you let the rest of your team know what you need done in order to get your job done.

Wish Swiftdeath · Aug 24, 2010, 10:23 AM // 10:23

I also tend to take spirit bond out because I don't use it much and instead bring guardian, soa AND shielding hands to deal with WOTA sins and other melee heavy builds currently being run.

Also PLEASE PLEASE use veil, I don't know how many terrible monks refuse to use veil even for spot clearing of hexes, it really sucks as infuse when you're stuck with the choice of getting infuse diverted or letting someone die.

But yes what most people have said is correct but I wouldn't spam aura on the monk just for the sake of it like people are implying, only use it when they're getting trained/you think they'll be kd - it's more effective that way since you can prot frontline getting linebacked or mesmer getting shutdown.

Just what I think, also for interface it doesn't really matter as long as you have comfortable key binds and a reasonably clear screen so you can watch the field.

Also it's a team game so if you're in an unranked pug and you keep wiping in 2 minutes because you have sighum, shame and diversion on you all the time then it's your teammates fault just like if they ball up in AoE, one or maybe two people earthshakered or kd in SH is okay because you can prot that easily however once 3 or 4 people stand in AoE, it's almost impossible to keep them all up.

Playing Is Srs Bsns · Aug 24, 2010, 12:04 PM // 12:04

counting wars adrenaline and covering prots help
vs some bbsway just look who has hammer and aos the target he is about to faceroll
also veil is cool if someone rupts diversion

Grumpy Bear · Aug 24, 2010, 01:26 PM // 13:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garet1337

and some really common sence stuff like keep Aura of Stability up on healer when vsing groups with KD

If you're watching the field you wouldn't need to this, just follow the hammer war and pre-AoS as necessary other-wise you are just wasting an AoS on someone that doesn't need it when someone else is getting KD'd.

Elektraaa · Aug 27, 2010, 08:13 PM // 20:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garet1337

I am not really new to monking and protting in HA but i'd like people's opinions.

What hotkeys and screen layouts should be used.
Basic stratagies for prots, and maybe even infusers.
And any other info you think is neccisary

Why not just name this how to monk succesfully in HA

Hi,

From your very first statement it made me think about the way one should approach learning. Obviously you're doing the right thing in asking for advice, but it should go beyond that. In my opinion, one will learn the most simply by telling one's self that they "know nothing". The reason for this is because when learning, if you think you already know something, you will miss something. Example, learning a program such as photoshop - if you read a book, and you go with the attitude "I'm ok, I'll skip this page", you'll probably find it harder learning than if you just say to yourself: "I know nothing, I am here to learn". Anyway, moving on to the point at hand.

I use ESDF for movement as well as click to move (this is important). There's three reasons for this, 1) It was suggested to me by fnatic.lauke several years ago in UT2004 (sad, I know). 2) It allows more keys around movement than AWSD 3) I like to stay familiar with keys across other games. I use ESDF in all FPS games, I use it in mmorpg(s).

Binds:

A: - This can be gaurdian, aura, it's not super important.
Q: - This goes to condition removal. If the skill is an elite (RC) - I will put it here. I do not place an elite in a certain spot. I think it's illogical to always have elites as skill 1 for example. I place the skill based on my ability to use it, and how often I will use it.
W: - Second most important reaction based skill. (RoF for example)
R: - Most important reaction based skill. (Spiritbond for example)
T: - I use this for gaurdian. When playing healer, I always remember T as my party based heal.
G: - Hex removal
B: - I do not suggest you swap A with B, even though your ability to press them is similar. The reason for this is, your last two skills when playing a GVG might be stances, shield bash, etc. B and V are close together. Skill 7 and 8 are close.
V: - Energy management. If playing another character, it will be res.

I make the skillbar quite small, there is no reason to have it big. So long as you can skills recharging, it's fine. Also, I've heard people say "you won't know when you're diverted". You shouldn't have to look at your skillbar to see when you are diverted. If you have to, you're doing it wrong.

Weapon swap bar, is also shown as small.

Weapon swaps/mouse setup, is as follows:
I use 1800DPI, simply because I'm used to it.
If you have windows XP, get a no acceleration fix (CPL mousefix). With windows 7, just disable "enhance pointer precision".

Not sure what mouse you have, I have a steel series xai, 4 buttons, two either side.

Cancel Action
Weapon Swap 4

Weapon swaps:

40/40 Set
Staff, (enchanting)
High Energy
-5, shield / spear : Note spear, not sword. Sword may cause you to get close to the opponent if learning. With a spear, you can attack the opponent which makes them think you are "focusing" on them. You might actually be focusing on another player.

Keys for weapon swaps:

Shift
Z
X also CTRL
Mouse Button

Attack I have as thumb button on the right. I have spacebar / tab / alt to show team and stuff. Cycling through enemies is 5. I don't use it loads, I prefer to click them. You can use C (target nearest enemy) to target yourself.

Screen Layout:

I have health bars on the right, out of the way a bit. You shouldn't have them in your face. If you do that, it promotes "red bar monking", that's bad, especially for a prot monk. I recommend playing with health bars off completely, for a while (AB or something not important to you). You should get used to clicking actual players and not their health bars. Ultimately you should hybrid it, the same as movement. There are times that clicking health bars can be good.

Veil will show up above the health bars. This makes it easy for me to remove, if I click someone, and then remove the veil straight after. Conditions/crap I receive off my bad playing enemy: That goes lower down (not top left, or whatever the default is). It becomes easier for me to see. I have(had?) my HUD set to "smallest". Health and energy I have side by side at the bottom.

When I click an enemy and see the skill they are casting, that is shown as quite large :}.

Regarding positioning:

A lot of people think that positioning isn't that important in HA. It is and it isn't. The only reason it isn't, is because the opponent generally isn't good enough to punish you for a positional mistake. You can run along with the attitude that you are going to take damage regardless of where you stand: therefore, why care? Well, it's simply...

If you stand far away from a mesmer, ranger, warrior, whatever. When they go to attack you / cast a spell on you, they will get closer. So if you pull back, the mesmer clings to you, you know that he is about to cast. Having said that, that doesn't mean you should stay far back, after all, some times you will want to use channeling (do people still use that?). Haven't really played the game in a while, so some things maybe out-dated, and my apologies if some of it is redundant, etc.

Basic strategies... Awareness is everything. Looking at characters do such and such, looking at groups of characters do such and such. Knowing when they'll do what. Why they'll do what. I suggest playing ranger, warrior, mesmer a bit. You don't have to be good, just learn a bit how they play. Maybe you already have done, in which case, great.

Remember:

Specific skill recharge times
Specific extremely dangerous skill recharge times (diversion, that kind of thing). This will help you know when to pre-veil.
Spike recharge times.
Mini spike recharge times.
Time of the map (when ghostly will need such and such, or a relic).
Anything in the game that can change how the enemy will play, you should think about

Some of it is guesstimating. You can either play by the book, or you can use extra energy guesstimating something. Not recommended all the time~ It's no good me saying "don't use too much energy". There are times that you can over prot on purpose. Sometimes you will be able to afford to over-prot. Especially in HA. This can help your team feel confident, if they aren't taking damage. This will make them play better, which in turn will make you have to play less. Other protting isn't always recommended. I'd say be dynamic, that's with the aforementioned, movement, that's with the red bars, that's with positioning, etc etc.

You can count mesmers energy, warriors adrenaline, etc etc. There are endless things that you can learn but it doesn't make you terrible if you are not always able to do them. Do not try to do everything at once. You should learn when to fake cast, and be quick at canceling a skill.

Get used to the sound of skills. Sound is good. You'll remember the things that sound bad. People on vent for example.

Garet1337 · Aug 29, 2010, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Thank u everyone for your replies, and thank u electraaa for going in such detail and for your advice

imma start learning all those hot keys and see if my guild can scrim me with henchies and take my prot to AB and try to learn ur tips a few at a time so I'm not overwhelmed

. I do sometimes tend to start red barring vs not so good random ways which makes me red bar the next match vs a more balanced group I still should b able to just watch and prot cd the wars

again thank u for going in such deapth and answering a kinda hard question, with HA becoming dead it's kinda difficult finding a decent prot so why not just become one

only reason people think I'm okay even though I red bar a lot is cause I was use to doing it on a sucky laptop so then all of the sudden I do it on a decent desktop where u can do everything so much better and faster

. Gw just wasn't made for an intigrated video card xD

Edwards · Aug 29, 2010, 07:58 PM // 19:58

I'm not the world's best prot, but I thought I'd mention a couple things that seemed to have been overlooked.

Generally, if you prot efficiently you will not need much/any channeling. DO NOT sacrifice positioning and view of the field for channel tanking, as this will only make you prot less efficiently and get you into a bigger hole. Don't be afraid to go into high set either. It's there for a reason, so just let your team know what your situation is and that they need to mitigate damage if possible. On the other end of your energy pool, make sure that you have a low set (shield + weapon with -5e inscrip to give you a total of 25 energy). You're at least twice as effective against the current Esurge meta if you use this set properly.

Key binds are a personal thing. There's no "correct" set up. As long as you are confident that your binds are comfortable and efficient, don't worry too much about what other people are doing. If you're not confident of that however, there is nothing wrong with borrowing ideas from somebody like Elektraaa who seems to know what they're doing.

Elektraaa · Aug 29, 2010, 09:43 PM // 21:43

Ah whoops, I totally forgot about those things (been inactive from the game too long >.>).

Yeah generally it's best just to get into the habit of switching per cast. High set is fine so long as you can see that it won't screw you over. Depends on the situation. In a gvg, you'll pretty much always go into a high set on a push for example. Also there are occasions that going into high - burning energy, then switching down to low and then dying is a fairly decent maneuver, especially for a healer on king of the hill maps. If two teams have been battling for quite some time and everyone about to crack, the monks all low on energy and lowish health: sometimes it's best to say "let me die" to the healer/prot. It can be better that you die, quickly rez up and then heal/prot all of the team better, than to live, fail at healing/protting and your whole team crunches. When looking at it from the opposite perspective, if the enemies monks just can't heal much, sometimes it's in your best interest to let them live and spike out someone else. Please don't go away thinking that I am saying you should always burn energy and then die for a rez. It's only applicable to certain situations

.

Dying before the timer, or not protting/healing too much before the timer of your team mates is also important.

With channeling, pretty much what 'Edwards' said, except you can use it a lot in some situations I think, like in HoH.

There are times that the prot can often get away with channel tanking more than the healer. Really though, as 'Edwards' said, try to avoid it if possible.
There is of course one huge down-side to spamming skills anyway, regardless of energy: you're just too open to interrupts and diversions, etc. Keeping a veil on the healer is also quite useful in some situations; that's just common sense and totally depends on the situation.

Keys are of course personal, you can make bad decisions though. It's illogical to use AWSD for two reasons. One: the natural typing position ASDF suits ESDF better. Two: You have more keys around ESDF to bind things to. I honestly have no idea why games default to AWSD.

Tearz1993 · Aug 30, 2010, 01:21 AM // 01:21

a huge general statement that probably seems obvious, but very few people do: prioritize what skills are necessary in each situation you come across. Making this more vague and less HA-centered to help me be clear.

Separate the skills in your head into small prots (shielding hands, guardian, shielding hands), hard prots (spirit bond, aegis), red bar (life sheath, RC, mend condition), and utility (AoS, veil, channeling). Decide which you need to use to either prevent damage or save a target. The biggest issues most monks have is not knowing when they need to use a hard prot, using hard prots way too late, getting caught using a utility skill when they should be using a small prot or a red bar, or in general wasting energy by using skills at the wrong time. If there's one thing to focus on, try to make sure you don't get caught using the wrong type of skill at the wrong time.

Also, keep in mind your other monk hopefully isn't useless. If you see someone's bar dropping quickly, using something like RC or mend condition might have a better effect in the immediate sense, but a much safer option would be using a small prot like life sheath or RoF to give your infuse more time to react to the spike. The same thinking should apply to Aegis: if you aren't going to get Aegis off before the damage hits, you shouldn't waste the skill when the spike can easily be stopped by the infuse monk. Try to time your Aegis either before the damage hits or, if you're consistent enough and the person you're monking with isn't awful, coordinate with the infuse that you have Aegis recharged and ready for use. This technique can be extremely useful against dedicated spike builds if you are confident in your ability to pre-prot the spike.

Playing Is Srs Bsns · Aug 30, 2010, 05:03 PM // 17:03

Against bala that has mesmer/ele+rit abusing bridgebug (in UW) its epic to channel tank there, cos u can watch mes and u wont (hopefully) have warrior on u. Also seems to be easier to watch the game from highground. Just my opinions btw.

Elektraaa · Sep 02, 2010, 06:34 PM // 18:34

Rof can also be used as a cover enchant sometimes, if you get the timing of it right (I know people use LS now).

We Play ''Fragway'' Alot · Sep 03, 2010, 12:36 PM // 12:36

I got a question, im trying to learn how to play infuse and prot monk. Playing infuse goes well but playing prot is kinda hard and im pretty bad since i play redbar. I know its bad playing red bar ^^ but anyway everytime i play prot monk i get confused very fast couz my team always go ball. Not the kinda ball that you get alot of aoe dmg but in a ball that i cant see who i need to prot. Is there sombody who can give me some advise for this on how to field watch this kinda situations. that would be great ^^.

Fluffy Kittens · Sep 03, 2010, 01:31 PM // 13:31

Watch screen to see where their melee is going and preprot... simple.
Against aoe soa and sb work perfect.
Just practice and you'll get it after few days it's not hard.
Everyone can watch screen and put some prots on but managing energy is what seperates good monks from the bad monks.

Missing HB · Sep 03, 2010, 02:37 PM // 14:37

Looking at the number of monks in id1 ( usually , if no friend available , you can wait easily 1 hour finding , and when both raging on 1st lose..... ) , i guess noone even want to try monking and that's understandable ( you need a strong backline against wota crap and bbway).

Fluffy Kittens · Sep 03, 2010, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Yes wota crap and bbway pretty much ruined the game since it's very hard to stay alive long enough to kill them. I remember bb sins got nerfed pretty fast I don't understand what are they waiting with bb war nerf. About wota sins...just nerf the elite and it's fine.
Seriusly all with all these rubbish builds there is no place for new monks who want to learn...you need the best monks in gw or you gonna lose all

elektraaaa · Sep 03, 2010, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by We Play ''Fragway'' Alot

I got a question, im trying to learn how to play infuse and prot monk. Playing infuse goes well but playing prot is kinda hard and im pretty bad since i play redbar. I know its bad playing red bar ^^ but anyway everytime i play prot monk i get confused very fast couz my team always go ball. Not the kinda ball that you get alot of aoe dmg but in a ball that i cant see who i need to prot. Is there sombody who can give me some advise for this on how to field watch this kinda situations. that would be great ^^.

Scream at your team to spread out. Don't become a super human just because people are bad.

Rest of the thread is OT.